Author Topic: The Meaning of Headstones  (Read 8579 times)

Offline Lord Daemon

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2007, 05:50:35 PM »
I guess I'm different from most folk then. I honour those who I care about by living and carrying within me those things they taught me and passing that on to others.

A poem my Grandmother had printed on her cards on her funeral (she asked for this in life)...


Do not stand at my grave and weep,
I am not there, I do not sleep.
I am in a thousand winds that blow,
I am the softly falling snow.
I am the gentle showers of rain,
I am the fields of ripening grain.
I am in the morning hush,
I am in the graceful rush
Of beautiful birds in circling flight,
I am the star shine of the night.
I am in the flowers that bloom,
I am in a quiet room.
I am in the birds that sing,
I am in each lovely thing.
Do not stand at my grave and cry,
I am not there. I do not die.


Guess I'm not the only one....
Man will believe the impossible, but never the improbable



Offline tk62

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2007, 06:14:12 PM »
You can learn in all the classrooms of the universe and have all the letters behind your name but until you experience it, you will only ever be an observer theorising as to what it is really like to stand at your loved ones grave and know the reasons why you stand there, sorry theory does not cut it.
"If our personality survives death, then it is strictly logical or scientific to assume that it retains memory, intellect, other faculties, and knowledge that we acquire on this earth." Thomas Edison

Offline PixxieQueen

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #17 on: October 21, 2007, 06:17:34 PM »
Sorry HLD tending to ones grave is not being stuck in your grief, it is part of the grieving process for many,and it is not, not moving on. There are standard phases of the grief process. Many go through these in a healthy and healing manner. The time in each phase depends on the individual. It becomes a not moving on, or not letting go when one does not move from a stage and behaves in an "abnormal" manner. ( for that person). Some of the healing process can be considered morbid and macabre by others. Such as a parent might want to know the sordid details and visit the site over and over again where their child was murdered. To some this could be considered not letting go or stuck in the grieving process. However, it is also part of the healing process. It is all coming to terms with the reality of the death, and then processing it in a healthy manner. Some move through quickly some take years. Now that is not to say everyone who visits grave routinely are still needing healing, for many it has become a ritual that is soothing for them in the sense they are displaying their affection for this person to the world and to others who may visit the grave. It is an informal way of displaying remembrance.
I am not one to argue but this are my opinions, felt from experience. Not everyone feels such as I. I know of parents who have never visited their childs grave.
Pixxi
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Offline PixxieQueen

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #18 on: October 21, 2007, 06:30:20 PM »
Do not stand at my grave and weep,
I am not there, I do not sleep.
I am in a thousand winds that blow,
I am the softly falling snow.
I am the gentle showers of rain,
I am the fields of ripening grain.
I am in the morning hush,
I am in the graceful rush
Of beautiful birds in circling flight,
I am the star shine of the night.
I am in the flowers that bloom,
I am in a quiet room.
I am in the birds that sing,
I am in each lovely thing.
Do not stand at my grave and cry,
I am not there. I do not die.

Absolutely beautiful words HLD. Wonderful for a person who has lived a long and fullfilled life. And true for each person who has passed on.However, these words are not of real comfort to any one who has lost a young one, their life cut short. I have been through the healing process I accept  death as something that cannot be changed. I know that death no matter what age has a reason, it is part if the journey. I also know spiritually they are with me all the time. I talk with them. But I still need the comfort to visit the grave, because in all reality  that is where they are - physically.
We cannot change what others think or their actions, but we can change our reaction, that is the choice.

Offline Lord Daemon

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2007, 12:38:38 PM »
Grief can take years to overcome, no arguement. But from a professional point of view, I would recommend counselling, obviously I would have to speak to the person at length before. But it is an area of concern.

I can't understand the grief of loosing a child, and I hope I never do. From what I know there is no pain or grief like it. So in that situation, yeah I will concede that there will be a marked difference in the grieving.

I am speaking more generally, in the case of parents, grandparents, uncles, cousins etc. Children are a different kettle of fish entirely. Possibly too, that with the pasing of a child there is an almost inherant wrongness about it...

I apologise if I had offended/upset/hurt you in what I have said. As I said I was speaking generally, children.. well completely different!
Man will believe the impossible, but never the improbable



Offline catseyes

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2007, 01:02:19 PM »
I think in the end its what gives you comfort.  I have lost people who have meant the world to me, i even had a nervous breakdown because of losing someone I loved more than life.  i have never felt the need to visit anyones grave, i have never worried at the thought that their tombstone is overgrown or fallen down, because for me they are not there.  I would be more inclined to turn a childs bedroom into a shrine then to go to a grave.  I think thought we all do believe that the soul lives on, its our different personalities that draw us to different places.


Offline tk62

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2007, 01:37:05 PM »
The thing with grief associated with death ( opposed to the loss of perhaps life style, job or trauma ) is that there is no getting over it, through it or anyway around it, what you do learn in time ( which most people confuse with healing ) is to live with this grief to function around it and to accept the new and different life that you now live, accepting that what was there is no longer there life is forever change, this is not healing, it is functioning because you must, it is survival ( and this perhaps is what people also confuse with healing ) and no counseling can heal grief from death, but it can help you to cope and that is where people confuse the two. A big thing to remember is that most people do not want to deal with another's grief, it hurts too much so they want to heal that person to make it go away, this make them feel good, they feel they have helped and now things can go back to normal, they do not need to have those uncomfortable moments when talking to that person and you will find that a lot of these people who are grieving become very good actors, they know what triggers other people to be on the healing podium, so they act appropriately as to not trigger this because it plain and simply upsets them more to hear of this healing, granted some do need counseling bit this is for coping only and anyone that tries to achieve anything else will be doing more damage then they realize, remember those that grieve the loss of a loved one blow those Oscar winners out the door.
 And yes CE everyone has their different ways they cope and not all is about the grave.
Rituals are a big part of coping they put the physical into the intention.
"If our personality survives death, then it is strictly logical or scientific to assume that it retains memory, intellect, other faculties, and knowledge that we acquire on this earth." Thomas Edison

Offline GaryTheDemon

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2007, 02:38:25 PM »
I've always said - funerals are for the living.  Ditto for cemetaries.  Sometimes, though, the dead don't always understand this.

personally, i'd rather be minced up for fertilizer.  but, if anyone is around to miss me, they'd probably rather have a focal point i.e. a grave.  I suspect my wife at least would like to be able to visit (and tell me off for something LOL).

I always try to remind people, though, that the body is merely the most superficial and unimportant part, and only the body is in the grave.  The other more beautiful part is half memory and half soul/spirit/mind/etc which is not dead.  (I omit any references to people haunting cemetaries trying to get back into their corpses etc :) ). 

ps. good councillors do nothing for you or to you!  Good councellors are catalysts to help you face your issue, and deal with it.  Dealing with it does not mean forgetting it or not suffering the pain - it means continuing rather than getting stuck.  Many councellors are not good councellors though.  Some prefer to suggest solutions.  that rarely works because they don't have the experiences of the people they are councelling.  Even a councellor who has lost a child cannot know what another person is feeling who has lost a child.  Even a rape councellor who has been raped cannot know truly what the councellee (?) feels.  They can have some ideas, but since everyone's experiences - and every one themselves - are different, they can only help the sufferer to find their own path.  Which is why good ones are life savers.


If you cannot love, then at least don't hate.
If you cannot help, then at least don't hurt.



Offline tk62

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2007, 02:56:56 PM »
I agree that a good councilor is a great thing to have in this world, but they need to know a few life truths and seldom do ( I am suggesting in any way you HLD are not a good councilor )
Gary a grave can be a place where your loved ones come to show the world just how loved you are, this is a big call to take away from someone.
"If our personality survives death, then it is strictly logical or scientific to assume that it retains memory, intellect, other faculties, and knowledge that we acquire on this earth." Thomas Edison

Offline GaryTheDemon

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #24 on: October 22, 2007, 03:21:08 PM »
As I say, TK.  It's for the living.  I'll probably be buried in a grave for that reason (only).  It would be selfish of me to be shot into space (for example) or diced up and fed to vultures if I were leaving people behind who needed that focal point.  for that reason I don't feel I'd get cremated.  a) too much smoke and b) it's hard for people to identify with ashes :)

If you cannot love, then at least don't hate.
If you cannot help, then at least don't hurt.



Offline Lord Daemon

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2007, 03:33:00 PM »
Thankfully I still have my parents. However I have lost all my Grandparents (they wandered of when I took them shopping, naughty little buggers. :) ) I no longer grieve for them. They are gone physically from this world. I know what I will never have with them, but that's ok. I got a lot from them while they were alive and I carry what they taught me.

Most people don't want to deal with their own grief let alone anothers, on that I agree. In my line of work I don't get a choice.

I guess on this one we will have to agree to disagree... we see the issue from very different worlds and obviously have different understanding and feelings.
Man will believe the impossible, but never the improbable



Offline tk62

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2007, 04:58:44 PM »
Agreed,and I truly truly hope you never get to see my side of it.
"If our personality survives death, then it is strictly logical or scientific to assume that it retains memory, intellect, other faculties, and knowledge that we acquire on this earth." Thomas Edison

Offline Lord Daemon

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Re: The Meaning of Headstones
« Reply #27 on: October 22, 2007, 06:06:42 PM »
Agreed!
Man will believe the impossible, but never the improbable



 


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